20 Minutes of Teaching Brilliance (On the Road with Trust-Based Observations)

Hi, and welcome to another edition of
20 Minutes of Teaching Brilliant on

the Road with Trust Based Observations.

Today, I have with me Morgan Adams,
and I was at Morgan School, Trinity

Midland in Midland, Texas in February.

Actually, I was in her class on
Valentine's Day, as she reminded me as

we were chatting before we got together.

started here.

And so, Morgan is a first grade teacher
and Morgan, would you do me a favor

and introduce yourself to the audience?

Tell us who you are, how you got into
teaching, maybe what your passion is, your

career path, and we'll take it from there.

Sure, thank you for having me.

I've been looking forward to this all day.

So I am a first grade teacher in Midland,
Texas, and I, it was one of those

things, you know, when you're little you
love teaching and having a classroom.

I always made my brothers pretend to
be the students and I was the teacher,

but as I got older I, I wasn't planning
on being a teacher for a living.

I went College in Fort Worth at TCU.

And I was a advertising public relations
major and it was my senior year.

I was about, it was about April
and I was about to graduate in May.

And you know, you don't have
very moments in your life when

you feel led to do something.

It wasn't like dark clouds and a voice
came to me, but I just felt a really heavy

feeling of, you need to be a teacher.

I called my parents and I told them,
and they both were like, Oh my God.

Gosh, you're about to graduate in a
month, but they were very supportive.

So we found a program at Texas Tech
where if you've already got your degree,

you can get your master's and teaching
certificate all in one pretty package.

So I did that and moved to
Midland and I got a job teaching

second grade at a public school.

And I just, I learned more from that
first class than I ever did before.

I walked in, I was 23.

And there was 18 of them just looking
at me like, what are you going to do?

And I was like, I actually
have no idea what I'm doing.

So, I stayed in public
school for five years.

I was placed in a testing grade
in third grade and it just kind

of altered teaching, you know,
it, it was so much pressure.

It was, the kids didn't
enjoy coming to school.

And I just thought, No nine year old
should feel like this coming to school.

So there was an opportunity to come to
a private school in Midland and I got a

job here and I've been here for 14 years
and I taught second and now I'm in first.

And those people, those six
year olds, they're my jam.

I could not love it more.

Morgan, that's great.

So it's so interesting in so many ways
that our path that gets us there, and

you're about to graduate and all of a
sudden it's like, no, this isn't it.

And then that little girl that,
that made her brothers be students,

whether they wanted to or not.

And I know your personality well enough to
know that you probably didn't make them.

And and it just hit you.

And then, you know, I mean, think
how lucky you are too to have had

the support, because financially,
what would you have done?

That was it.

It's like, hey, too bad, you're on
your own, and so you got it, and

then luckily, you were able to get
a, a, the program right away, where

you don't have to have your degree
necessarily in that, and, and do that,

and then you land in a good, Good spot.

That's a great story.

we talked a little bit before to talk
about what we're going to talk about

from the day we were observing you,
but you, you brought up something that,

that I want to talk about that wasn't
what we said we were going to talk

about, because I think it's important.

And you talked about when you moved
to third grade and starting with No

Child Left Behind, that's when the
big testing mandate started, and

it was just 2002, a generation ago.

And how, what I heard you say, not
directly, but what I interpreted

you saying is, by the way, those
Stanley bottles are from Seattle,

just so you know, they're made
in Seattle, my hometown, yep.

well, well done.

yeah, it was all me.

I said, don't use Craig,
though, use Stanley instead.

And so, and in Texas, I know I've gone to
different, like, Kagan Training Workshops,

and I've sat with Texas teachers, and in
Texas, they've gone so, I mean, everywhere

it's gone crazy, but maybe at the high
end of the list is Texas, where even in

third grade, they start breaking you down,
because you're the literacy teacher, and

you're the math teacher, and what I've
heard from speaking to people is, you

spend all year teaching to the test, Not
really having an enriching full thing.

It's just that, and it's just, and I,
my intent is not to anger listeners, but

that makes me so angry and frustrated
that, that, and look, the people that

did No Child Left Behind and Race
to the Top, they're well intended.

I, I don't doubt that they're not well
intended, but dang it, we've been doing

this for 20 years and we're not seeing
improvements in scores for 20 years.

So let's stop.

And change it.

And so, sorry, I had to get on my
little horse there and do that.

What was it like for you when you went
from being, teaching little kids and

being able to, because you, you have a
very vivacious personality and, and we're

going to get into that down the road.

And in some ways that had to have
almost, not killed it, but could you

want to talk about that for a sec?

Luckily, I was at a school
where I had an amazing team.

They helped me to know what to do, and
I had an amazing class, amazing parents.

The only part that sucked the
joy out of it was the test.

Because, you're right, that's all
we did every day was test taking

strategies of let's not look at a
book and enjoy it and talk about it.

And yet, it was read the test.

How do we answer those questions?

I had a little girl one time, she came
to school and I kept looking at her and

I was like, well, something's different.

I can't figure out what it was.

And her mom said she pulled out
all of her eyelashes because she

was so stressed about the test.

And when I saw that, it just
really, it broke my heart to think.

I was like, I want school to be a
place where kids can't wait to go.

They don't know what's going
to happen that day, but they

know they're going to have fun.

And we would have moments
of those, but you're right.

It was kind of hard to bring
in the joy of learning when

there's just so much pressure.

I remember the first, at the test,
I wore my shirt backwards to school

because I was so nervous and my
students were like, Miss Adams.

I was like, what?

They're like, your shirt's on backwards.

I was like, Oh, thank you.

Yeah, it's I'm glad you got out of there,
but we, we still have a lot of work to

do to fix that, and it's not improving
teaching and learning doing that, and I

think obviously you know how passionate
I am about teacher observations, the way

we traditionally do observations also is
not improving teaching and learning, and

almost this, it's funny, I never thought
about this until right now, and I know

we're going off a little subject here, off
the subject a little bit here, but in the

way that you just kind of talked about, it
sort of kills the joy, For the kids having

to teach to the test, the way that we do
observations, when we've got a Danielson

or Marzano, when there's all these ratings
and you've got this pre observation

conference, and then you come back and
then they rate you on all these things.

Am I proficient or distinguished
or needs improvement or whatever?

It, I think there's an amazing
parallel that it sort of kills

the joy in a way for teachers.

Any thoughts on that?

I think the best way, honestly,
for teachers to learn is to go

to other teachers rooms that
are still in the trenches doing

what you're doing every day.

And I, there's nothing like,
your job, that would be the most

fun ever, to go see classrooms
every day and see how they work.

Because

And then get to interview them
afterwards and create a podcast.

That sounds like the most fun ever.

Hire me.

But if you go to other teachers
classrooms and ask questions there,

I think that's more beneficial to
teachers than having and you know,

admin are very well intentioned
that, you know, wanting to improve.

And I think

doing the system that's been
given to them to do, to observe.

Same thing with you as a teacher.

I didn't want to teach this way.

This is what I was told I had to do.

Yeah.

be at a school now where we're given
creative freedom to make the classroom.

You know, we're like, if we're reading
a certain genre, we can turn our

classroom to where we bring tents
in and have camp outs, you know, to

just we have Clifford Day where kids
get to come and we do dog races.

That's what kids will
remember when they're older.

I agree completely.

And I just do have to give a little trust
based observations plug and I say, I think

that trust based observations allows.

It would be more like a
joyful conversation about

It was when y'all came and
afterwards we sat down.

It was more of a conversation of what
y'all saw, and I like the part where y'all

ask kids what they were doing too, because

what they were learning, what they
were supposed to be learning, yeah.

Exactly, because sometimes you know, when
they're doing their work independently

that y'all get a different sense of what
they were doing versus my perspective.

So I really enjoyed that part
of the conversation afterwards.

Super.

Wow.

Gosh, we spent 10 minutes.

We aren't even sort of talking
about the teaching yet.

But, but then it's okay.

It's good.

So, listen we were there on Valentine's
Day and you were playing a Valentine's

bingo and we never really want anybody
to feel like they, they're We don't want

anybody to change what they're doing,
but when all of a sudden six people with

laptops walk in, you probably think this
isn't probably what we're going to do.

And so you, even though it wasn't
required, you graciously, on your own,

decided to move on to what you were
going to do next with your, your literacy

centers and, and So, when I think about
you, Morgan, I think about you have, you

won't take this in anything but a positive
way, you have big personality, and you

understand the role of relationships in
classroom management and student success.

I mean, you were just talking about
finding joyful things for kids, right?

And personality and relationship
and tapping into who I am.

factors into that quite a bit.

And so, do you wanna,
let's, let's start there.

Let's start with relationships and
personality and how that factors in to

good teaching and learning for kids.

So I just want you to just riff.

Well, you know, when you get your class
list at the beginning of the year, most

of the names you don't know, there's
a few you might know and the whole

first six weeks of school, that's what
you're doing, is getting to know them.

I love when I get siblings, because
you get to see how similar and their

differences, and you get to see the
ones that are very big personalities,

and others that are more reserved.

And it's my job.

to earn their trust because until that
happens, they won't open up to me.

And, you know, especially if they're
struggling with something, it might be

embarrassing to come and say, Hey, Ms.

Adams, I don't understand this.

But once we've got that relationship,
then they feel free that they can do that.

So, we do things to build community.

So, in my classroom, every morning, we,
you know, come to the floor, we read

a book, and then we sing some songs.

I've read research where communities
that sing together, they're,

they're more bonded together.

So we sing songs, and then
we have a morning prayer.

And like, if a student is absent,
and they lead the prayer, they say

it, and they're the most beautiful,
heartfelt things you've ever heard.

They'll pray for a student
that's absent, and then after

that, we get going with our day.

And you know, as the year goes on, you
might go to a kid's birthday party, or

if they're sick, we sometimes I'll video
the class and say, We miss you, we hope

you feel better, because All kids want to
feel loved and valued and I want each of

them to know that, you know, after from
August to May, they are one of my kids.

Sometimes you spend more hours in a day
with them than you do your own families.

Absolutely.

little nuggets in there and I think,
Look, they all want to be loved.

They all come from different backgrounds.

They all have their baggage,
like we all have our baggage.

And sometimes that's the most
stable place in their lives is that.

And so, giving them that sense
of, and you do, genuinely do,

develop that care for them.

And even, even, that's not the
right word, the ones that are more

challenging, we also, we care for all
of them, I guess is what I want to say.

And, and so.

Finding ways to demonstrate that, like
making a video for a kid that's been

absent for a few days with the whole class
waving to them and then sending that home

so the kid can see that, like, like, I
feel my heart warming literally right now,

just as I'm saying that, just thinking as
a little kid who was a shy kid, like, how,

how special that would have been for me,
and then I think there is that power with

music as well that you're talking about,
and I want to dig more into this, but you

said something else that, that I Because
of trust based observations, sometimes I

have to, I feel like things come up that
have to make me bring it back to that.

And you said, My job
is to earn their trust.

Until they do, they won't open up to me.

And it's the exact same thing with
a teacher as it is with a kid.

It's my job as a principal to earn
your trust and for us to have real

conversations about practice to
support your growth, you and I

together, whoever together doing it.

That same thing has to happen.

We have to build that trust
with you or the same thing.

So it's just so interesting the parallels
between teacher to student and principal

to teacher and, and that's one of the
things about traditional observations that

just drives me crazy is that hypocrisy.

We would never give feedback to
kids in the way that traditional

models give it to teachers.

Let's go back though into,
into relationships and fun

and what you do to make it.

And because you know when it's fun and
when they feel loved, like you said,

you're going to get more out of them.

You, you talked a little bit before
we were that you, you've got a little

bit of theater and improv background.

And, and, and do you just want to go a
little bit more there and how that factors

into what you're doing on a daily basis?

Because you were even talking about
your centers and talking about the

way you structure your centers and,
and, and even the novelty of them.

I think that all, it's not directly
relationship, but it is in a way.

And so do you just want to go there?

Sure.

So, my goal is for my class Every
morning they go, I can't wait to go to

school, because they love being with
their classmates, they love being with

us, and then they love learning, and
they don't know what's going to happen.

So, sometimes in the mornings, you know,
we're practicing poetry, but instead

of just repeating it, I'll say like,
okay, now let's say it like we're mice.

And so they'll say, the nicest part
of being in school, or, and then I'll

say, let's do it like an opera singer,
you know, and some of the kids that

are shyer, they, they might not do it,
but they're looking around grinning

because it's just fun and silly.

And then sometimes in the classroom,
you know, it's all how you say it

that makes them more interested.

So let's say you're gonna read
something, but you say it like,

we are gonna go on the floor to
read a book without our shoes on.

And they all were like, Oh my
gosh, I can't believe, you know,

just something simple, but how you
present it makes it more exciting.

Do I mean, we're talking about and,
and you know, and first graders are

so, they're so wide-eyed, right.

That it, that it, that it,
that it plays into that.

So, well, I mean, do you, do you
spend time actually Morgan, in your

planning thinking about those things?

Or are you relying in the moment on it?

I'm relying on them.

And also kids at that age, they
still believe in the magic.

So, I have a gajillion
llamas in my classroom.

That's my go to mascot.

So, let's say I'm teaching a math game,
I'll use one of my stuffed llamas to

be my partner, and I'll do a voice
for it, and they can see my mouth

Right, right, right,

But they believe it, and so I'll
say like, Linda the Llama is gonna

play on me, and Linda will be like,
I don't understand, Miss Adams.

And I'll be like, well, if you don't
understand, then come ask me, of course.

And so that, that you're touching
on also the power of, of puppets.

But what I'm even hearing
you say is, I mean, 'cause.

Morgan, like, you, you have a big
personality, and, and, so, as, as

somebody that's more extroverted, at
least in the classroom setting, I think

that's easier, what if I, like, what,
what advice might you give to some, a

teacher that maybe feels like they're
a little more quiet or introverted, to

be able to do the same thing, because
they, I mean, like, people, like, when

I'm at training schools, people don't
know that I'm really more introverted,

but I am, but I can, it's easy, so
what, what would you say to a teacher

that's that's a more quiet teacher, To
get them to do the same kind of things,

because I think anybody can do that.

Absolutely.

And you know, it's different for a
teacher, like, talking to a big public

audience, that would be intimidating.

But once you get with your own people,
like your 15 group of kids, most

teachers feel they can also let loose.

I mean, I've gone on Instagram and
YouTube and looked up songs for first

grade, classroom songs to get ideas,
and I find myself, if I watch someone

else do it, I'm more likely to be
able to like, oh, well, I can do that.

And you're right, singing and
all of that is not for everybody.

But, and if it's not for you,
you could ask a student to do it.

Say give them a stuffed animal and
say, show me how you would play

the game with this Linda the Llama.

and maybe your more extroverted
kids would be more likely to do

it if that's not your cup of tea.

Yeah,

heard you say is really, it's researching
and finding your own ways to research.

Because there's things out there, and
I always say, show me a good teacher

and I'll show you a good thief.

absolutely.

so that's, that's great too.

Okay, so let's jump into when we were
there two things were going on there were

centers going on and literacy at the same
time and so why don't we talk about your,

your centers and, and the management of
them and then definitely I want to talk

about those fake glasses and the symbol
of those two where you want to talk about

it and what order is up to you, but go.

Okay, so at the beginning of the
year every teacher knows you're

teaching them how the classroom runs.

So I'll have displayed on the smart
board what day it is, what center it

is, and their name will be under it.

So it might say listening center
and underneath it it has their name.

We do this for about two weeks, where
I don't even pull reading groups.

I'm circulating among the class,
teaching them how to do centers.

You know, every,

Routines, Routines, Routines,
Behaviors, Expectations, all

Absolutely.

Well, you know, every classroom has jobs
like line leader, caboose, door door

holder, where one of my jobs is check me.

So, when I'm at reading group, they're
not allowed to come and interrupt me

unless they're hurt, bleeding, or ill.

So, if they have a question, or if they're
finished, they have to go check me.

to the check me person and show
it to them, make sure it's quality

work before they turn it in.

So like you said, I have a pair of
glasses that are fake and I changed

the colors and if I'm wearing the
glasses, that's the signal to them.

They can't interrupt me unless
they're hurt, bleeding or ill.

And if I take off the glasses and that
means they, yes, come ask me a question.

But just that silent
signal to them is helpful.

of them.

And again, it's fun too,

Yeah.

To hear that Miss Adams check

think this year I'm going to
glue like feathers or jewels on

them to make them even more fun.

Yes.

your literacy stuff.

Because we talked about differentiation
with that, and we've talked a

little bit about building routines
and expectations at the other.

Thank you.

But when you've got your groups and you've
got your readers for 10 or 15 minutes

before you're doing those rotations and,
and, and those centers being engaging

in, in, in structure, and you talked
about novelty is important, right?

So just go for

So, the centers, a lot of them
repeat, like the listening

center will be there every week.

They've, I've got a CD player back there
with a seat, you know, the book, ding,

turn the page and they listen to it.

But I mentioned earlier that I think
it's a delicate balance between structure

and novelty where the kids like.

For this age especially, they like
knowing what's going to happen, but

they, they know they're going to go to
the spell, they know they're going to go

to the spelling center, but they don't
know what they're going to do there.

So one week, it might be stamps.

The next week, it might be play doh.

The next week, it might be they
have Cheerios, and they're putting

the Cheerios on a word to spell it.

So the kids keep engaged, and if they're
engaged in their learning, that leaves

less room for, you know, Disruption or
arguments, anything that could happen

engagement is magical.

year olds.

Right.

And then I had one center this past year.

Every year you teach, you're like, well,
why haven't I thought of that before?

So, I tried this this
year and it was so fun.

I got 15 books and I recorded
myself reading each one.

And I would, send it to the parent
and the kid would take the book home

and they would listen to me read it.

Well, then I had post its inside the
book and with each kid's name on it.

And next to it, it was either a
question mark or an exclamation point.

And the kid had to write either their
favorite part with an exclamation

point or a question they had.

when they brought these books back at the
center, they would get to flip through the

books and see what other kids had written.

So it was just something different
that they, you know, That they

had never done before, just to
make reading more fun to them.

And not all of the centers
are literacy based.

I do have a math center.

And at the math center, I make sure that
it's something that they have done before.

Cause if it's new and, and
they're unfamiliar, they'll get

frustrated, but it might be puzzles.

It might be dominoes.

It could be a game of dice.

Again, it, it changes every week.

Listening to the, the, the, you talk
about the, the, the stories that you

read aloud and record, and then you send
home, and then you've got the, the, the

post it notes with the questions, it's
one that's so creative and engaging, and,

and, and like, did that just come to you?

Did you just, like, it just,

I just thought of it.

yeah, you just thought of it.

But, but I think what it
touches on though, because

that's a lot of time, Morgan.

to, to record yourself doing 15 stories.

And I know these aren't like novels,
but because they're first graders, but I

think sometimes it is, how do I say this?

Like throwing out some stereotypes
and it's not everyone, but some

of the younger teachers, and I
really, really, really value this.

If you were to throw out like Gen Z,
they would talk about work life balance.

Like, and I think that's fantastic.

Like, I am not a workaholic.

I do not believe in it.

I always thought it was
BS, to be honest with you.

And I hadn't worked in one school
where it was mandatory that we

all had to be workaholics as a
principal, and it was horrible.

So I think it's great that there's
that, but sometimes with that

then comes it like, well, it's 3.

30 and, and, and especially when you're
a new teacher, Because I, if I'm going

to have work life balance, I want to
make sure that when I come home, I'm

not stressed, which means I have to
make sure that what's happening in my

job has to be super engaging, right?

I mean, make it engaging for the
kids so I'm not, like, the kids

aren't misbehaving or whatever.

And so, do you just want to talk
on that for a sec related to, like,

the amount of time that that takes
and then the cost benefit analysis?

so, I mean, I truly feel
teaching is a calling.

It's, you know, it's not a high paid job.

It is a job that you, your body,
mind, and soul are invested.

And At the end of the day, am I tired?

Absolutely.

But I can go to bed at night
with my head hitting the pillow,

know that I made a difference.

You know, my name is never going
to be in history books, but I

had fun with 15 kids that day.

And I also like the fact that my own
children get to see, you know, okay, mom's

going to work every day and she's working
hard because you're right, with this

new generation, I want my kids to value
someone working hard and providing and

Being a good example, so, like with those
books you were talking about, so what

I did was, so it wasn't such a massive
undertaking, I did that in January, so all

in the fall, I recorded one book a week.

Huh.

Right, you're not, you're
not overloading yourself.

It was over time.

Exactly, so it wasn't so daunting.

And, like, your first few years
teaching are the most difficult.

They're, you're, it's, you're, Body
is literally exhausted but most, if

you're lucky, and I was so fortunate,
you've got mentor teachers to help

Yeah.

Yeah.

a teacher, my gosh, I
wouldn't have survived.

My first year, she would come
in my room and she'd be like,

What are you doing from 8 to 8.

30?

What are you going to do if your lesson
doesn't go as long as you think it's going

to, and you have five minutes to spare?

Things that you just don't think about.

So, if I was a, If I was a new
teacher I would seek out advice from

mentor teachers and go watch them.

So, what I'm hearing you say is, is,
one, like, like I said, the work life

balance is good and it's important.

Yet.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Preparing yourself and knowing that it's a
calling and knowing that I'm here to make

a difference in the lives of young people.

Not at the cost of like, burning myself
out, but finding the balance in there

somewhere in terms of putting in that
time, especially when we're younger

and we're still learning what to do.

And like you said, what do
I do with that five minutes?

Because if I don't know that it's
like, Oh my gosh, we finished early.

And then it can go off
the rails so quickly.

Right.

very quickly.

And so then seeking out counsel from,
and I mean, this is a tricky one too

because sometimes you end up with a
great team, sometimes not so much, and,

but when you can, would you think if
you, if you ended up on a team that

wasn't such a strong team, would you,
and it sounds like you were lucky, but

if, , knowing what you know now, would
you seek out help from a different

school, somebody at a different school,
somebody on a different grade level?

What would you do in that situation?

I'd go to a different grade level.

I mean, I still do that now.

I love going to kindergarten classrooms
and second, you know, it might not be

as beneficial if I went to a grade level
that was like three or four above me,

sure,

but the grade below and the grade above,
those would be wonderful places to start.

So if we don't have that, and for those
that don't, and, and we know it's a

mixed bag, it's, and, and for those that
don't, then seek that out above or below.

Is, is your, is your advice on that too?

When you're with the kids and you're in
the literacy groups, what are you doing

to make that engaging for them as well?

So, every teacher knows when they
come to reading group that you're,

you know, they're differentiated
by their reading level.

So, but all of them start with
the same structured routine

that leads us up to a book.

So we'll start with word work.

We're starting with a spelling pattern.

Let's say it's digraph OO.

We'll practice, like, a lot of times
I'll give them mirrors, and they

look at their mouth in the mirror
and see what their mouth looks like.

They'll look at their neighbors.

Then we'll have all of written words
on sentence strips and cut them up and

have them all have that O O pattern.

And then they work together
to put them in A B C order.

Then the next day, it
would be the same thing.

We're still on digraph 00, but
let's do a different activity.

Let's have, I would have a sentence
that I had written, cut it up,

they have to put the sentence in
order, and I always give them clues.

Find the word that has the
capital, find the punctuation mark.

Those are your end marks.

Then let's work together, and I'm there
to help as a guide if they need it.

After we do a little bit of word work,
then let's say I give them a sentence,

And I'll say the sentence, and I'll have
them hold up their hands to hold up,

to mark every word, then they repeat it
back to me, and then they'll write it.

I have a dry erase table.

They'll write it on the table.

After they've all written it, I'll have
them switch places with each other to

look at their neighbors, and there's never
any, you know, shame or embarrassment.

Say, oh my gosh, you spelled that right!

Awesome!

Or this one, oh, you were so close!

Then they go back to their own,
look at it, and then we delve into

a new spelling pattern where I give
them a phonetic book, they'll look

at it, and we go through the book.

And Once that starts, it's amazing.

That's why I love first grade so much.

They grow and change as readers so much.

It's the most amazing to see from August
to May how much they grow as a reader.

You know, Morgan, one of the things that
stands out to me, and like we talked about

earlier, I do get to watch teachers all
the time observing, I think, like I've

said before, I think I get to see more
teachers through the lens of observation

than probably any human being, literally,
and one of the things with feedback that,

formative assessment and feedback, that
I don't see As much as I'd like to, is

I see teacher, teacher led formative
assessment, checks for understanding,

progress monitoring, whatever language
you want to use, but I don't see the

peer to peer as much as I'd like.

And so, I really, really like that I hear
you saying, we're looking at each other's

and we, because we know when I look
at your work, in some ways that's more

powerful for learning than looking at my
own work, or hearing it from my teacher as

absolutely.

Morgan, this has been absolutely amazing.

I know there might be people that want
to learn from some of your creative

ideas that we've talked about today.

Would you be willing to share
with our listeners, a contact

Absolutely.

or something that they could reach
out to you with if they wanted to?

Sure.

Absolutely.

So my email is madams at trinity midland.

org.

So trinity t r i n i t y midland m
i d l a n d and it's just one word.

No spaces.

org.

Thanks so much, Morgan.

Morgan, it has been an absolute pleasure.

I really, really appreciate you taking
some time to chat with us today.

course, it's been my pleasure.

Thank you so much for having me.

Take care.

Bye bye.

Bye.